[bootykush]

I plan on doing some shooting in bars and clubs, give a shirt for a booty shake kind of thing... I was wondering about the legalities on that.

If I give a woman a shirt and she drops it low shaking her ass, do I need to do a model release form even though she's doing this in a public setting?

I just see it being a big pain in the ass to constantly check i'ds and run around with a stack of papers for them to sign... I dont see the need for making a copy of the ID's if the bar / club is 18+...and no need for real forms because its in a public settings... I may be completely wrong, please help!

Thanks

[gonzogone]

that would fall in the category of risky as all hell...

Regardless if the club is 18+, you don't know if they got in without proper ID. If your intent is to put them on your site, you need a release to use their image. If you're working in the area of needing 2257 docs, then you know how much you need to have on file for every performer.

Now, that's the easy part... the more tricky part is the professional photographers I've heard talk about using settings like that say it's REALLY a good idea to get a release from the site owners to indicate that they are not going to try and take you to court for showing their property on your site. This goes for private residences, businesses, etc. What I don't know is if there would be a difference between the owner of a property and somebody possibly leasing the property. You may actually need a release from both.

Oh, and if anybody else gets in the shot... you 'should' get releases from them as well...

It's all a pain in the @$$, but it's also going to keep you out of legal trouble if somebody decides they suddenly have a problem with what was done months or years ago.

[VoyGeorge]

Haven't we discussed this somewhere here?

Anyway, in most cities it's not legal. The bar/club doesn't have a license for it. Strip joints are licensed for a very narrow activity. They can't be used to produce material for publication (that includes the Internet). This, of course, goes for when it's open to the public. How the building is used when it's closed is another matter.

Maybe the strip clubs near you are zoned differently, but that's the way most are.

[bootykush]

I am not filming any nudity...just ass shaking and girls dancing....I also have already talked with two club owners and both of them welcomed me in with my camera crew they said something about posting a notice on the door of the club saying we will be filming, etc...

[pornlaw]

Go ask Reality Kings how it worked out for them...

They got hit with a mulit-million dollar copyright infringement lawsuit from Warner Bros and Co. due to the fact that they captured and rebroadcast the music playing in the club.

They are trying to claim fair use, but I dont give it much of a chance. This one could cost RK $15 million at the end of the day.

Dont shoot in clubs for several other reasons as well.

Michael

AdultBizLaw.com - Fattorosi & Chisvin

[gonzogone]

Michael - really appreciate you popping in on things like this!

[Tigger]

cheques in the post

[pornlaw]

Originally Posted by student4ever

Michael - really appreciate you popping in on things like this!

My pleasure. I lurk every day and check on things... I only post to threads where I think I have something informative to say... Which is 99% of the time legal discussions.

Michael

AdultBizLaw.com - Fattorosi & Chisvin

[VoyGeorge]

Originally Posted by bootykush

I am not filming any nudity...just ass shaking and girls dancing....I also have already talked with two club owners and both of them welcomed me in with my camera crew they said something about posting a notice on the door of the club saying we will be filming, etc...

It doesn't matter what you're filming. It's a production for distribution to the public that's the problem.

If the club owners said it would be okay, hopefully they know their zoning laws.

On your original question, do you need a model release - of course you do! For non-news events you need a model release of a fully clothed person staring dumbly into the camera.

Ask Michael, but I'd say that booty shaking could be considered sexually suggestive. Then go read 2257A. You want the ID to show you made sure the subject was 18+.

[bootykush]

I have really got to move out of United States.

[bootykush]

Moral of this story is to be really careful.

1. Make sure every one dancing in video signs release form. Be sure to cut out anyone that I dont have release forms for.

2. Be sure that the DJ is either playing his own music + get him to sign some paper stating he wont be playing any copy written music that he does not hold rights to.. or I simply overlap the sound with my own music from local artists...

3. Hire my own hoes for the night to make sure I have some kind of content when leaving the club.

4. Make sure club owner agree's and signs off to the fact that I will be filming, etc. Make club owner post a notice for the event day.

5. Any model that dances which I did not hire must show a photo id...I am thinking to quickly take a photo of it while in the club or just flash the video camera over the id for a clear shot.

Any additional ideas?

[gonzogone]

clarification for the music aspect, even local artists could be an issue. Say they suddenly make it big and remember you are using their music? By the way, they just signed rights over to Biggie-Music-Conglomerate, who now wants a piece of you...

You need a full release for anything that is not yours, and make sure they have the ability to sign the release. Past that, I know a lot of people who use garage band to produce their own tracks.

[housekeeper]

Here in NY we have the 'Mayors office of Film and Television', I would imagine every city has an equivalent. They provide the permits required for filming, albeit a club, restaurant, on the street, or wherever. When an establishment allows use of their premises for commercial activity, they have to be paid, Once I was watching a movie starring Gina Gershon (hubba, hubba), and when the camera pulled back it was my friend's apartment she was in. I have even been approached myself by TV shows to use my apt, my friends restaurant was a popular place for filming as well over the years and they pay quite hamsonly.

So the thinking here is that there is a right and legal way of going about things, even if your best friend owns the club, some contract or monetary exchange would be in your best interest. On the other hand where is the legal line drawn, we have been filming at tranny parties for years now, content is generally not used for commercial purposes though other than promotion. Also, I used to watch a show here on Manhattan cable community access that was produced by a couple of young hispanic dudes from uptown, they were doing just as you are suggesting, filming large booty spanish and black strippers during working hours. The action got pretty wild at times and even for local cable access they allowed some nudity. All I know is it fell under their local broadcast laws, I'm going to guess those guys didn't bother to acquire any of the legal docs.

So then here again, you'll see all kinds of video's on Youtube taken in clubs, basically everything is filmed these days regardless of whether people are aware or not. Clearly the lines have been skewed, or at least people are getting away with a ton of shit. With respect to producing your own content for your business, be on the safe side at all costs, as everyone has already pointed out...

[VoyGeorge]

The big cities are a bit different (they have strong local unions) but in general a location permit is not needed unless shooting takes place in a public place, or otherwise impacts the public. The latter could be 10 production vans parked along a residential street.

In Los Angeles, San Francisco, New York, Chicago, and other towns where there is a large union presence, the crew won't shoot at a location unless it's permitted. One reason is liability insurance. In order to get the permit the production company needs to demonstrate adequate insurance for cast, crew, and property. The lighting rigger doesn't want to be personally responsible if something burns down.

[pornlaw]

Originally Posted by bootykush

Moral of this story is to be really careful.

1. Make sure every one dancing in video signs release form. Be sure to cut out anyone that I dont have release forms for.

2. Be sure that the DJ is either playing his own music + get him to sign some paper stating he wont be playing any copy written music that he does not hold rights to.. or I simply overlap the sound with my own music from local artists...

3. Hire my own hoes for the night to make sure I have some kind of content when leaving the club.

4. Make sure club owner agree's and signs off to the fact that I will be filming, etc. Make club owner post a notice for the event day.

5. Any model that dances which I did not hire must show a photo id...I am thinking to quickly take a photo of it while in the club or just flash the video camera over the id for a clear shot.

Any additional ideas?

Insurance -- production insurance to cover the venue and equipment and workers comp to cover the crew.